HackerNews Readings
40,000 HackerNews book recommendations identified using NLP and deep learning

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zhte415onOct 31, 2020

Dostoevsky, Crime and Punishment, a fascinating read, not an easy read either, but if any HN reader is looking for something... a masterpiece that is true to today across countries and cultures.

robin_realaonFeb 5, 2019

Ah, well if we’re plugging I also did the SE production of Dostoevsky’s Crime and Punishment, with bonus incredible cover by Edvard Munch: https://standardebooks.org/ebooks/fyodor-dostoevsky/crime-an...

sdfinonDec 31, 2019

Yes, I read Crime and Punishment about one year after The Brothers Karamazov. I think The Brothers Karamazov is a great book.

tinesonSep 5, 2020

+1 for Constance Garnett, she was by far my favorite translator for Crime and Punishment.

toygonJan 20, 2019

You should read Crime And Punishment by Fyodor Dostoevsky. The perfect crime might exist, but the perfect delinquent won’t ever.

lancefisheronDec 22, 2018

I strongly recommend Crime and Punishment.

sealjamonMar 7, 2017

This is effectively Raskolnikov's justification for committing murder in Dostoyevsky's Crime and Punishment.
Sorry for the spoiler, but you've had 150 years to read it.

joenot443onNov 4, 2019

I think there's a very wide range in difficulty for Dostoevsky's work. Crime and Punishment and Notes from Underground are a reasonable length, are told in a linear fashion, and largely easily differentiable characters. Brothers Karamazov, on the other hand, I found very challenging.

gnulinuxonApr 6, 2019

It's interesting that this is a scene from Dostoevsky's novel Crime and Punishment. I always wondered if it's a bizarre coincidence or some sort of influence went into the novel, or reports about Nietzche's life.

kurtisconOct 3, 2019

When I read Crime and Punishment, I realised many of what I saw as flaws could be explained by the fact that it was published as a serial. You can't retcon what's already released.

toygonJuly 18, 2019

> most crimes aren't throughly-planned, well-executed Hollywood-grade bank heists

And this is why Crime and Punishment is an ageless masterpiece of literature.

robin_realaonAug 11, 2017

I contribute nice versions of free ebooks to the public domain via https://standardebooks.org . Working on a complete Keats collection and Crime and Punishment at the moment.

igammaraysonMar 30, 2020

Crime and Punishment. So many others over here have already recommended Dostoevsky, but he deserves even more praise. Taught me the meaning of "sin" in the modern world. Taught me to find love in suffering.

emodendroketonDec 29, 2019

I've enjoyed a few Dostoevsky books, especially Crime and Punishment. The Odyssey is also a blast.

accnumnplus1onDec 22, 2018

I've only read Crime and Punishment, but this was exactly my observation of it. I really wasn't impressed with it, and then suddenly, almost exactly half way in, it kicked off and I was engrossed.

steve_ghonAug 15, 2019

For me, it has to be Tinker Tailor. A truly great novel about the lies people tell to themselves and others. A spy novel in the same way that Crime and Punishment is a police procedural.

jl6onAug 17, 2017

You might be interested in Crime and Punishment by Dostoyevsky.

TL;DR: enemies are people too.

stephen_gonMar 7, 2019

In my copy of Crime and Punishment it has some names (especially place names) where the end notes say it was partially redacted to get the manuscripts past censors. Not necessarily the case for every redaction though.

playing_coloursonNov 4, 2019

Dostoevsky is dark and deep, but it may feel an easer entertaining read - say, Brothers Karamazov. Crime and Punishment was harder for me. Tolstoy is more difficult to read due to epic long sentences.

Ulysses and Paradise Lost are in their own category.

dmixonNov 4, 2008

I am currently finishing Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand for the first time and it is has become my favorite book by far. I began reading it after someone referred it on here.

Next up is Crime and Punishment by Dostoyevsky.

paedubucheronJuly 28, 2021

When I read Dostoevsky's "Crime and Punishment" in school, I mentioned to my teacher that the investigator reminds me of Columbo. I only remember my teacher answering me, that Columbo is one of the few crime series to be of good quality.

Almost fifteen years later I read this:

> “The Columbo character was based squarely on Porfiry Petrovich, the astute but meandering lead investigator in Dostoevsky’s Crime & Punishment.”

Which makes me kind of happy :-)

emodendroketonAug 21, 2018

I did not like the Hobbit, but other door-stop books like Moby Dick and Crime and Punishment I really have enjoyed. Seems stupid to stop because you didn't like one book. Would you write off movies if the first one you saw were bad?

lackeronApr 9, 2021

I also couldn’t get into Crime and Punishment, and I read a lot of books and loved The Brothers Karamazov. The idea of just quitting books that you enjoy is really important... for me at least, I feel like I get more out of the top 10% of books that I read than I get out of the bottom 50%. Sometimes a great book only clicks when you’re 1/4 of the way through it, though.

clippertononMay 10, 2018

What sort of cultural points might be missed on a non-Russian person reading Dostoevsky? I just finished Crime and Punishment a couple months back and am curious, if you have the time.

DEbCBonMar 10, 2018

Why would anyone read a serious novel, like Crime and Punishment, instead of a comic book? Mozart's Jupiter Symphony will still be performed and appreciated fifty years from now. Can the same be said for your cherished rap/pop songs?

elcometonJan 4, 2020

Not the OP, but I can name a few.

I found Anna Karenina, or Crime and Punishment 100x better than all non-fiction books I ever read.

sdfinonDec 29, 2019

I read Crime and Punishment after reading The Brothers Karamazov.

I found Crime and Punishment shallow in it's story and characters when compared to The Brothers Karamazov.

sxcurryonJune 23, 2016

I just finished Crime and Punishment using the 30 minute method. I ended up having to back up 20-25 minute each time - took a long time to finish the book! (I listened to the last few chapters during the day to make sure I heard the entire conclusion.)

shitgooseonApr 11, 2016

Crime and Punishment is a thick book, there must be a Reader's Digest version somewhere. Try it.

toygonDec 13, 2015

> If I ever do something illegal, I will never talk about it after the fact.

Dostoyevsky's "Crime and Punishment" should be a compulsory read for any self-respecting criminal mastermind, if anything to stop them from saying "I will never do X and they will never catch me".

swombatonOct 8, 2008

How about some real books?

- Narziss & Goldmund, by Herman Hesse

- One Hundred Years of Solitude, by Gabriel Garcia Marques

- Crime and Punishment, by Dostoievsky

- The Trial, by Kafka

- L'étranger, by Albert Camus

If you want to build your character, read the real stuff: fiction.

toygonApr 19, 2021

Did you read “Crime and punishment” by Dostoevsky? It’s about this very thing. What is crime without attribution - of success as much as of guilt...?

deathWasp271onMay 11, 2018

Bookmarked.

I picked up Crime and Punishment a few years ago, but had to put it down, due to both foreseeable and unforeseeable circumstances. How would you introduce it if you were to recommend it to someone?

weeksieonMar 29, 2020

Depends on how old you are, or for me it did. Some books resonate at different points in a person's life. The fiction that's had the most impact on me as an adult was all stuff I read in my early 30s.

* Tropic of Cancer by Henry Miller — Perfect for a single man in his 30s. Very solipsistic and hedonistic, which is a great way to explore that decade. Each of the books in the series is a novel length prose poem. Absolutely beautiful

* Journey to the End of The Night by Louis Ferdinand Celine — my favorite book in the world. Very misanthropic, set in WWI. The protagonist finds himself drafted into the war and does his best to survive while the brave people around him die like idiots, it escalates from there. The most beautiful line I've ever read is from a part of the book where the protagonist is hanging out at a brothel: "Toward one of the beautiful girls there I soon developed an uncommon feeling of trust, which in frightened people takes the place of love." there are jaw-droppers like that on every other page

* Crime and Punishment — a cautionary tale about exactly the kind of solipsism and misanthropy that can take us over in our 30s. Fast paced and beautifully written, it reads like a modern crime thriller.

For fun conceptual stuff

* Ficciones by Borges — short stories that will twist your mind up, each are more puzzle than narrative, but tremendously engaging nonetheless. Ted Chiang is the modern writer that I would identify as the most similar in spirit to Borges.

As a note—I'm a speculative fiction author. Most of what I read these days is sff and nerdy lit fic. The value in fiction is the same as the value in philosophy, it exposes you to the inside of peoples' minds in a way that other forms of narrative entertainment do not, and the real good stuff acts as fuel for concept creation.

serheionJuly 8, 2008

Dostoyevski's "Crime and Punishment" offers an interesting exploration of this idea.

alexkonMay 25, 2019

Can I offer a complementary non-practical founders reading list then? :)

* Dostoevsky "Crime and punishment".

Discover how important is to take care of yourself and avoid entering the downward spiral of depression and anxiety.

* Jack London "Smoke Bellew".

Get a boost of the startup-like resourceful energy the heroes of the previous Golden-Rush at Klondike.

* Herman Hesse "Siddhartha".

Get a break from the startup grind by going on the spiritual journey of self-discovery and peaceful reflection.

* Arkady and Boris Strugatsky. "Far Rainbow".

Get to know the limits of human intelligence and capacity for overcoming the difficulties.

Hope you enjoy it!

jaxOLanternonDec 28, 2019

Zen mind beginner’s mind: Highly recommended to anyone interested in meditation. Helped me understand the non-goal aspect of the practice.

Gravity’s rainbow: Not the easiest read but immensely rewarding. For better or worse some of Pynchon’s vivid descriptions are burned into my soul.

Crime and punishment: I’m not into literature but this one is worth it. A great dive into human psychology.

Deliverance: intense story, read it in one night. Not sure it taught me much but man it is good.

The True Believer: Thoughts on the Nature of Mass Movements. Great insights on the way ideology and politics work.

Wasted time on a bunch of self help books. Most tips contained in these require you to accept yourself and the world to be applicable. And that’s the hardest bit...

robin_realaonSep 6, 2020

I put together Garnett’s Crime and Punishment translation for SE at https://standardebooks.org/ebooks/fyodor-dostoevsky/crime-an... if anyone wants to read it.

stochastic_monkonMar 24, 2018

Crime and Punishment is a stunningly powerful novel.

For anyone who enjoys it or Notes From Underground, I highly recommend Demons, which extrapolates the ideas from both previously mentioned to societal scale.

I think it's his best by far.

A note on translations: I've read at least two translations for each book of his I've read. I generally prefer the Pevear/Volokhonsky translations, but there are times when the Garnett translations capture the spirit a little better. Both options are excellent, but read the Pevear/Volokhonsky if you have to pick one. Reading multiple translations can ultimately help provide a fuller experience.

jveldonApr 2, 2016

Dostoevsky (The Brothers Karamazov, Crime And Punishment) was sentenced to be executed by the Tsarist government in 1849. He was actually in front of the firing squad, waiting for his turn to die, when he learned that his sentence had been commuted to a measly 10 years hard labor in Siberia.

One could argue that this was the defining moment of his life, and most of his greatest works were motivated in some way by the intensity of that experience. So yeah, for lots more on this, read Dostoevsky.

kartikkumaronApr 18, 2014

A deeply thoughtful literary great, to rank among the likes of Dickens, Cervantes and Dostoyevsky in my mind. Love in the Time of Cholera changed me, just like Crime and Punishment did. It affected me more than any other book has. At the time of my life when I read it, I felt that it spoke to my personal sensibilities. I followed that up with Memories of My Melancholy Whores, which I honestly think is his absolute masterpiece.

Gracias Señor García Márquez.

versaleonDec 31, 2020

> 7. In the end, the shameless individual is the most free. Shame is an ugly emotion, because social norms are often ugly and limiting. The sensitivity to shame is a strong character flaw that must be overcome. In the end, if you are just a host for ideas as mentioned, why not pick the path of self-affirmation.

I guess this idea isn't particularly new and has been thoroughly researched by many. For some reason Nietzsche comes to my mind. And Dostoyevsky. E.g. from "Crime and Punishment":

"I wanted to find out then and quickly whether I was a louse like everybody else or a man. Whether I can step over barriers or not, whether I dare stoop to pick up or not, whether I am a trembling creature or whether I have the right."

michaluonDec 22, 2018

I recommend you start with the "Idiot" ... Crime and Punishment is his masterpiece but I believe it's not the best first book to read by him. After there are Brothers Karamazov a less known book but very beautiful. The rest you can find with simple Google search, Dostoyevsky is I believe unparalleled in the world's literature.

pjungwironApr 21, 2015

Came here to recommend Brothers Karamazov and also add David Copperfield. I've read Dickens was a favorite of Dostoevsky, and David Copperfield has characters you'll remember all your life. It is especially good to read as you're setting out on life, e.g. halfway through college.

One story I've heard about David Copperfield: in Russian monasteries, there are abbots who forbid novices from reading any spiritual literature until they've first read David Copperfield, because while the goal of the monastic life is to become more like God, first you have to become human.

For the Russians, especially Dostoevsky, if there is a translation by Richard Pevear and Larissa Volokhonsky, that's the one to pick. It makes a huge difference.

As a college senior, after devouring pretty much all of Dostoevsky, I read Anna Karenina largely because in On Moral Fiction it is John Gardner's favorite example of a great novel---and it was so boring. Now that I'm 38 I think often of re-reading it, if I can work up the gumption. I'm glad to hear you found it not so heavy.

A favorite English professor in his 60s told me he was still re-reading Crime and Punishment, but Brothers Karamazov didn't speak to him anymore, and he felt it was a young man's book. I've been trying for 15+ years to decide if I agree.

SaturdaysonNov 4, 2020

Thanks for sharing this. I take goodread reviews very lightly, especially for new books which I figure are either done by folks who get early access, book bloggers, etc.. (which I assume comes with their own bias at the pleasure of early access) and now throwing in 'bots' into the mix..gross!

I did enjoy 'The Humans' and 'How to stop time' but would never mark either of them as 5 star books, mainly because I would count books like 'Madam Bovary' or 'Rebecca'or 'Crime and Punishment' as a 5-star book. Nonetheless the praise for Midnight Library irked me before I even took a look at it. Folks are so keen on jumping to 5-stars without a critical approach to it.

Rather than a single 1-5 star system, a questionnaire with 1-5 stars for aspects of a book could be a better way to rate.

From 1-5 how would you rate:
1. the plot
2. enjoyability
3. character development
4. etc...

and then average out the scores across each aspect to get the user's score on the book.

Obviously there is incentive for goodreads to push for 5-star reviews all around, for the most part, because who wants to buy a 1-3.5 star book from Amazon? Also a larger scale or more options to choose from with rating would lead to lower conversion of rating submissions.

I won't claim to be perfect about rating books either, but its appalling when a book like 'The Midnight Library' (4.3 as of this time) has a higher rating than 'Crime and Punishment' (4.2).

leohonOct 8, 2019

I read Golden Pavilion earlier this year. What an incredibly powerful book. I scarcely can think of a novel that felt so psychologically realistic, that portrayed humiliation so clearly. Oe's "Personal Matter" and Dostoevsky's "Crime and Punishment" deal with similar themes — the destruction that can be wrought by a sense of humiliation and alienation.

atomic77onMar 24, 2018

I also coincidentally re-read Crime and Punishment a few months ago and was also struck at how differently I saw it today than as a college student.

I would be interested to understand how you came to the conclusion that he argued for both sides? I saw a scathing repudiation of the socialist utopians of the era (and 'rational' ideologues of all sorts). He 'argued' their sides too, but with the goal of making them appear ridiculous. By the time Raskolnikov's fictional essay about the "extraordinary" comes up, i think it's pretty clear what Dostoyevsky is trying to say. Though that's just my interpretation.

gruseomonJuly 21, 2012

I'm off to read some Dostoevsky.

In that case I've done some good! If you want his critique of capitalism, The Gambler is pretty good. But if you want sheer entertainment, I think The Double is one of the best things Dostoevsky ever wrote. It was only his second novel, and before he was sent to Siberia. His first novel Poor Folk had made him a huge star (even though it's no longer thought to be very good). So he thought he'd top that and came out with The Double which was so weird and out-there that everybody immediately pronounced him a has-been. It's complete genius, though, and very funny.

Edit: if on the other hand you want the classics then Crime and Punishment is likely your best bet. It's all about what happens when someone takes an idea to its extreme conclusion and acts on it. And it's his easiest big novel from a story point of view.

eivarvonSep 9, 2015

The Brothers Karamazov - Fyodor Dostoyevsky.

Picked this up after recently finishing The Selfish Gene, as I remembered what a thrilling read Crime and Punishment was.

Dostoyevsky is funny, thought-provoking and anxiety-inducing as ever.
Unlike some other authors, he rarely makes characters whose viewpoints he disagrees with into cheap caricatures with bad arguments.
He is intellectually honest and provides unprecedented (at least for its time) psychological insight into his complex characters.

I have always been sad to finish Dostoyevsky's books, but as the Penguin Classics version is around 1000 pages long, it will hopefully take a bit longer this time around.

stochastic_monkonJuly 13, 2018

You’re spot on! Good catch.

Now, while the narrative style is different in the later of these books, if you enjoy NFU, I recommend both Crime and Punishment and Demons.
I see Notes From Underground, Crime and Punishment, and Demons/The Possessed as unified by a core set of ideas.
In the first, Dostoevsky states his claims. Crime and Punishment is a case study of what would happen should an individual act upon the ideas of his (Dostoevsky’s) time, and Demons extrapolated this to societal scale.
I may not be in the majority, but I think Demons is by far his best.

trgvonJune 20, 2018

I don't agree.

Take Dick for example: whether his writing deals with "the highest kind of truth" is not important to me. I've read just about everything he's written because I enjoy his writing.

I think this is equally true for Dostoevsky, Conrad, and other acclaimed writers. When I read those authors, I have an emotional reaction. It's not research. I didn't come away from Crime and Punishment with a better understanding of why people commit murder. I don't understand "nautical psychology" any better for having read The Shadow Line. I was moved by those novels. I'd say that makes them entertainment.

I don't think acclaimed literature belongs in a different category than teenage supernatural romance. Twilight elicit an emotional response from its audience just like Ubik does. The emotions, technique, and the audience could hardly be more different, but I see no reason that one of those novels should be categorized as "base entertainment" and the other as "high art". They're both entertainment.

Some literature may contain a thesis but, in my opinion, it mostly doesn't. If someone has to "study" a novel to "get the point" then that novel has failed, at least with regard to that reader.

Just my opinion.

More on topic: I enjoy Roberto Bolano's thoughts on Philip K. Dick: http://www.electriccereal.com/roberto-bolano-on-philip-k-dic...

gjm11onNov 4, 2019

There are different kinds of difficulty-to-read. I had the following experience multiple times with Crime and Punishment: I would pick it up and start reading, and think "wow, this is really amazing stuff", and then at some point I would put it down for a day or two and then somehow not want to pick it back up again. Not because it was hard to follow (it isn't), nor because it's badly written (it isn't), but because the world it puts you inside is a pretty unpleasant one.

(I did eventually read the whole thing, of course, and I'm glad I did.)

lnkmailsonMay 11, 2018

A conflict of visions, Sapiens, Crime and Punishment and http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/alexandersolzhenits.... I've always been introspective but also was significantly less open minded than I imagined myself to be. These books opened me up to experience introspection in better ways. I think Solzhenitsyn's address is the one that really made a huge difference. My Russian boss pointed me to it :).

shreyanshdonDec 12, 2018

  East of Eden - John Steinbeck
Of Mice and Men - John Steinbeck
The Grapes of Wrath - John Steinbeck
Cannery Row - John Steinbeck
Crime and Punishment - Fyodor Dostoyevsky
Man's Search for Meaning - Viktor E. Frankl
Deep Work - Cal Newport
The Little Prince - Antoine de Saint
The Subtle Art of Not Giving a F*ck - Mark Manson
Flowers for Algernon - Daniel Keyes
Notes to Myself: My Struggle to Become a Person - Hugh Prather
Tuesdays with Morrie - Mitch Albom
I Heart Logs: Event Data, Stream Processing, and Data Integration - Jay Kreps
Kafka: The Definitive Guide - Neha Narkhede
Effective Java - Joshua Bloch
Algorithms - Robert Sedgewick, Kevin Wayne

YeGoblynQueenneonMay 29, 2021

>> Your run of the mill Russian is honest about their feelings. Not honest about the facts, no, they can cheat on an insurance filing just fine. But that coldness that so many of them seem to have is often just an outer shell. Once one of them trusts you and gets to know you they're so warm and intense about their love for you. So excited to show you something dear to them. Even devoted enough to learn a new language just to speak to you, even if they're a senior[0]. It doesn't mean the relationship always survives, because that intensity is still there when they're angry, but the highs are so high.

I'm not a great fan of serious literature, but I've read a bit here and there and I think the above should be blindingly obvious to anyone who's read at least as little as I have (basically, Crime and Punishment, three or four pages from The Idiot and Gorsky's The Flaming heart of Danko). Or, anyone who's listened to the music (hello, Chaikovsky? Black Swan? You wanted feelsies?) or watched the movies (Tarkovsky) etc.

I think in the past the literature and the art in general would have been where Western people learned about Russians (and everyone else not in the West, also, but the Russians have a lot of literature). It's a bit of a shame if this has really been replaced by tinny stereotypes promulgated by Hollywood.

gk1onDec 22, 2016

I've read 13, which is half my goal of 24, but it's still more than the year prior so I'm satisfied. The three that stand out to me (recency bias in full effect):

Crime and Punishment by Dostoevsky - I went back to Dostoevsky because I needed a break from business books... Something to distract me from work in the evenings. Dostoevsky's overly descriptive narrative does a great job of transporting my mind to 19th-century Russia and far, far from my work and other present-day concerns.

Essentialism by Greg McKeown, and Deep Work by Cal Newport - Pairing them together because they both reminded me the same important lessons: 1) Do fewer things and do them better, 2) Being overly busy is not a sign of success.

jaxOLanternonDec 29, 2019

Did you read "Crime and Punishment" just after "The Brothers Karamazov"? Or could you have outgrown this type of book?

throwaway84742onMay 10, 2018

As a Russian, I don’t understand how Americans can “get into” Dostoevsky or Tolstoy. The cultural background required to understand them is simply not there, so you’re getting maybe 50% of what’s there, and that’s an optimistic estimate.

Likewise, I’m not sure I fully understand Hemingway, Steinbeck, etc. I enjoy their work, to be sure, but I’m afraid not to the extent Americans enjoy it. Thus far I have not found an American novelist who would be anywhere near Dostoevsky or Tolstoy. My favorite US novel is “Grapes of Wrath”. Absolutely beatiful work when read in the language it was written in.

My favorite Russian novel is “War and Peace”. Russian school children are forced to read it when they’re like 15, and they don’t get it, of course. After re-reading it at 40 I was blown away. Such immense depth, such masterful pacing and character development.

I have recently re-read Crime and Punishment, another one of those books Russian school children are forced to read with no hope of understanding. I was likewise impressed with depth and sheer brutality of it. I wouldn’t say Raskolnikov hated the world. That’s not quite right, too black and white. Dostoevsky operates in the gray area. Raskolnikov was, at his core, a kind young man (see eg his empathy for Sonya), but an extreme nihilist, and he was stuck between a rock and a hard place, from which his nihilism offered him no escape. Struggling to reconcile his ideology with his humanity, he commits a stupid crime, for which his humanity makes him suffer immensely. If he really did despise everything, he would sleep well.

curi0ustttonOct 1, 2020

This a very personal opinion based on some popular classic book lists like those found on 4chan /lit/ etc.
(Note: All books are new and I calculated the price from Book Depository [0], you might be able to purchase more from Better World Books [1]):

- The Holy Bible
- Moby Dick by Melville
- The Brothers Karamazov by Dostoevsky
- The Master And Margarita by Bulgakov
- Don Quixote by Miguel de Cervantes
- The Iliad by Homer
- The Odyssey by Homer
- Meditations by Marcus Aurelius
- The Count of Monte Cristo by Alexandra Dumas
- The Decline of the West by Oswald Spengler
- The Qur'an
- The Prince by Machiavelli
- The Art of War by Sun Tzu
- Crime and Punishment by Dostoevsky
- The Confessions by Saint Augustine
- Les Miserables by Victor Hugo
- We by Yevgeny Zamyatin
- The Book Of Five Rings by Miyamoto Musashi
- The Bridge on the Drina by Ivo Andric
- Bosnian Chronicle by Ivo Andric
- Growth of the Soil by Knut Hamsun
- Storm of Steel by Ernst Junger
- All Quiet on the Western Front by Remarque
- The Divine Comedy by Dante

--- This list totals out at 311.14EUR and has 23 books.
[0] - https://www.bookdepository.com/
[1] - https://www.betterworldbooks.com/

wazooxonJune 9, 2020

The book I've reread the most is The Odyssey. For a long time, I've read it once every year.

Another book I've read many times is Eco's Foucault's Pendulum.

I've read Asimov's cycle of Foundation many times. Don't know how many, actually.

I've also read several times some philosophy classics, particularly Plato's Symposium, Phaedrus, Apology and Republic.

Then there are many books that I've read at least twice, almost all considered classics (from 1984 to LoTR, Great expectations to Tom Sawyer, Crime and punishment to Twenty thousand leagues under the sea, etc).

coryfkleinonJuly 11, 2017

I think extending the analogy to spoken languages can reveal some biases we have. If Dostoyevsky lived in Africa and wrote Crime and Punishment in Swahili, would it ever have gained the notoriety it has?

david927onFeb 5, 2019

Crime and Punishment, Dostoevsky

Les Miserables, Hugo

Several stories by Kafka

Dubliners, Joyce

HoushalteronJan 1, 2016

I have no idea what your point is. If Crime and Punishment was illustrated, then it would take way more space. A single picture might take up more space than the entire book. It's just the reality digital images. And if you don't want images, well then you don't have to wait until they download.

He does make the point that most images are unnecessary. But then he puts dozens of unnecessary images into his web page! Even he doesn't follow that advice.

therealdrag0onMar 1, 2021

I thought about this too when I was reading Crime and Punishment recently. The protagonist is described as very poor, but they still have a room in a house, and their room even includes house meals. Similarly with other poor characters; sometimes their space was just a sectioned off area of a bigger room (maybe like a floor-ceiling cubical). But hey, that's gotta be better than sleeping under a freeway for most people.

duopixelonJune 27, 2020

Basecamp first launched when I was in college, and being completely unfamiliar with any project management workflow I thought: "this would be great for managing myself" so I set milestones and wrote entries for myself and project managed my life for a brief period.

It makes life as boring as work.

These methods are meant for teams working towards a common objective, where anything extraneous to the OKRs is considered a distraction. This has its shortcomings (I've met way too many project managers who seem to be so absorbed by metrics they fail to see what is right in front of their noses). It's most definitely useful is this context, but not in life.

Consider: the author has set himself to read 20 books per year. Suppose this is double of his standard. What he will do to fulfill his OKR? He's not going to choose a difficult read such as Ulysses, or an existential crisis inducing book such as Crime and Punishment, he will go for what is more superficial and easier to read, because his goal is not to be transformed by what he reads, his goal is to read 20 books.

The crucial layer of meaning is lost when we project-manage ourselves. Life is more akin to a poem than it is to a project.

urmishonMay 10, 2018

This novel, along with 'Crime and punishement' deal with completely opposite personalities. One has a very optimistic view of the world, the other, Raskolnikov from Crime and Punishment, despises it and justifies violent crime with this mentality. Wonderful works, both of them. Unlike many, I read TBK first and decided to read Dostoevsky's other works and fell in love. Notes from the underground will always hold a special spot in my heart because of how much I can relate to the protagonist unfortunately.

Can anyone recommend other similar works of literature? I haven't read many books like this but I found Siddhartha, Narcissus and Goldmund and Steppenwolfe by Herman Hesse to be on the same lines (deal with existentialism).

1arkonSep 9, 2019

Crime and Punishment (1866) by Fyodor Dostoevsky.

pmoriartyonNov 21, 2016

What would you have to do in order to learn what was in Crime and Punishment if you didn't read it?

robin_realaonMay 1, 2018

The descriptions are written by the producers, and explicitly donated to the public domain as part of the production.

Covers are interesting. The imprint has gone for a “classic oil painting” style as a general rule of thumb and those need to be PD as well of course. That’s trickier than it sounds in the US, as to be PD they need to have been published in a book in the US pre-1923. For example, the edition of Crime and Punishment I worked on has an Edvard Munch as cover art.[1] I managed to find that reprinted in a copy of “Scandinavian Art”, published in the US in 1922.[2] Unfortunately just looking at the PD tags on commons.wikimedia isn’t good enough as they rarely provide proof and anyone can edit them; the project could get into real copyright trouble without having proof of PD.

[1] https://github.com/standardebooks/fyodor-dostoevsky_crime-an...

[2] https://hdl.handle.net/2027/gri.ark:/13960/t8x93xv1g?urlappe...

westoncbonMay 10, 2018

I'd be curious too. I read Crime and Punishment, Notes from Underground, The Double, and other short stories—and I found them to make quite a bit of sense.

I didn't get the sense that I'd extracted everything from "The Grand Inquisitor" (excerpt from The Brothers Karamazov), but I got the feeling it was just because it was more deep and compact, but would yield fruit with further study (even as an American).

ytersonApr 7, 2008

Check out Dictator:
http://dictator.kieranholland.com/dictator.html

It lets you set how many words are visible at a time, so you can use it to do the exercises jakewolf mentioned.

I could read Crime and Punishment at about 600-700 wpm (around 200-300 is normal) and I think I still had good comprehension. You can also adjust the speed as you go if passages get more difficult.

Also, when I read normally, I don't read linearly. I scan a page and narrow in on interesting words. Usually, if the material isn't too tricky, I can understand a paragraph very quickly this way. It is how I read online.

Finally, it really helps to think about what the author is saying, especially if I try to anticipate what's next. This gives me something to compare and contrast with, which makes me retain and understand what I read much better.

jxubonJune 24, 2018

> Any idea if the english translation of Witcher by Danusia Stok is good?

I've just doublechecked that the official English translation is good indeed, I haven't got first hand knowledge though
https://www.quora.com/I-intend-to-read-the-Witcher-books-but...

My knowledge of Slavic literature limits mostly to the Polish and some Russian authors, despite that I can recommend a Czech satire book that I liked: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Good_Soldier_%C5%A0vejk

Other than that, Czeslaw Milosz for the poetry, Henryk Sienkiewicz has some great novels about the history of Poland (The Trilogy and The Teutonic Knights are damn hooking and intense), Zofia Kossak Szczucka (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zofia_Kossak-Szczucka) is another solid historical writer. I am aware however that my tastes in literature are somewhat eclectic.

Russian Lit: Nikolai Gogol for the stories, Solzhenitsyn for the Gulag Archipelago, and of course War and Peace (Tolstoy) and Crime and Punishment (Dostoevsky). Reserve some weeks for the last two though, heh ;)

Any help you need, just shoot me an email (in the profile), but I'm not an expert by any means :P

niels_olsononAug 24, 2012

I walked out of the library today and was treated by the free books stand. I got Crime and Punishment, The Crucible, The Old Man and the Sea, and 4 others of equal caliber. And when I got home, I was reminded I'm out of shelf space. In mymind, that's a great reason to get a bookshelf. To my wife, not so much. Dead tree books have negative value to a growing percentage of the population.

BTW, for those buying, unless you're a reporter, I highly recommend the large size. If you look at the notebooks of great men, most tend to be closer to the larger size. Michelson is the one that sticks in my mind, since I walked past those notebooks every day for 7 years.

throwawayu75rt5onSep 5, 2020

I second this in some way. I started reading their Crime and Punishment translation. It was boring, the words didn't flow. Kinda clunky. Kind of the same with their Brother's Karamazov translation. Some people recommend the following translations, by Oliver Ready and Ignat Avsey:

https://www.penguin.co.uk/books/177606/crime-and-punishment/...

https://global.oup.com/academic/product/the-karamazov-brothe...

Constance Garnett seems good too. Most of her translations are in public domain.

mechanical_fishonJuly 8, 2008

Perhaps the guy really isn't an emotionless robot built entirely of ego -- and, now that his self-defense instinct has exhausted itself, his urge to stop lying, express some entirely authentic and long-suppressed remorse, and save his wife's family and his own children from a lifetime of uncertainty has finally won out.

(For further insight into this aspect of the human psyche I recommend Dostoyevsky's Crime and Punishment.)

Or, perhaps he's an emotionless robot playing the role of a remorseful human being. If so, I think it's about time. It's not as if Plan A was working out well for anyone.

Requiescat in Pace

tagawaonDec 23, 2012

Oh, it has to be Crime and Punishment (Fyodor Dostoyevsky). Blew me away. http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/2554

For lighter reading, The Adventures of Sherlock Holmes (Sir Arthur Conan Doyle). http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/1661

ntsplnkv2onDec 23, 2018

I first discovered Dostoevsky in undergrad engineering school. Needed gen eds and ended up taking a class that sounded interesting that talked about the philosophies of the superman (ubermensch) and it started with Crime and Punishment.

It was the best class I took in undergrad, it was so interesting to read and discuss. I think I needed to be in that class, though, to really get what I got out of it - so perhaps it is ok to come across them later in life. They almost require experience.

KaibeezyonDec 29, 2019

I read Crime and Punishment last year and found it incredibly disappointing, considering its massive reputation. Simpletons, idiots, caricatures, buffoons and victims performing lots of hand-wringing, posturing, dithering, swooning and assorted drama. Hard to identify with or care about any of them. Call it entertainment, but I prefer Dickens.

marnettonNov 6, 2018

Steinbeck, Vonnegut, Dostoyevsky, Ursula Le Guin, David Foster Wallace (I could truly go on forever, but I think these authors are phenomenal, with themes and meta-themes different from one another).

I think if you watch an interview with DFW you will realize just how much he has thought of just about every facet of modern, entertainment-centric western society - all coming together in Infinite Jest which is the most depressing book I've ever read (he later committed suicide, so it might have been the most depressing contemporary book ever written either). Le Guin's The Left Hand of Darkness models an entire planetary civilization with no fixed sex (written in 1969, mind you), which I found very eye-opening. Dostoyevsky's The Brothers Karamazov (as well as Crime and Punishment) are extraordinarily psychological and philosophical - ethics, free will, and God are centric. Both Steinbeck and Vonnegut have multiple books I'd recommend, but East of Eden by Steinbeck is an all-time favorite tackling good and evil (honestly Nietzsche in novel); Slaughterhouse 5 by Vonnegut (just a notch above Heller's Catch-22) is the embodiment of darkness and absurdity. Take an anti-war sentiment and an author willing to tiptoe to the border of sanity and insanity and the result is SH5. It is truly brilliant, and as someone who is fortunate enough to not have ever been impacted greatly by wartime, it is equally eye-opening.

Honorable mention (a book I have read more recently) goes to Tom Wolfe with The Bonfire of the Vanities. This book combines the legal system (police and prosecutors), personal greed and ambition (Wall Street bond salesman), racism (Media biases), and class structures and privilege in a hard hitting social critique on 80s New York City. Everything between its covers is key to understanding how the world actually works.

This turned out to be a lot longer than I anticipated. Hopefully it is helpful!

mindcrimeonDec 22, 2016

I've read 13, which is half my goal of 24, but it's still more than the year prior so I'm satisfied.

I was a little disappointed that I only got through 24 this year. My goal was 75, which would have represented a stretch beyond the 53 I got through last year. But it turns out that I picked a couple of really long books this year, AND I spent a lot more time this year doing stuff like taking Coursera classes and what-not, which cut into my reading time.

All in all, I guess it just shows that a simple number like "titles read" isn't really all that meaningful. :-)

Crime and Punishment by Dostoevsky

I really want to read this. Maybe in 2017.

vittoreonSep 13, 2020

"Live is suffering and you need something more meaningful than pursuit of happiness to make it bearable" seems to be central idea of everything Jordan B. Peterson writes and speaks about.

If I could add to this list:

- everything by Alexander Solzhenitsyn that was translated to English.

- Crime and Punishment by Fyodor Dostoevsky

- Demons by Fyodor Dostoevsky

- Ward No 6 by Anton Chekhov

pmoriartyonMar 24, 2018

One of the things that struck me upon rereading Crime and Punishement recently was how forcefully and persuasively Dostoyevsky argues for both sides of issues. Whereas with lesser authors one can easily tell which side of an issue they are on, with Dostoyevsky it's not so easy (though you can infer from the mere fact that Dostoyevsky chose to write about them at all that he cares deeply about them).

The most unsympathetic of his characters are also portrayed quite sympathetically and compassionately. The reader really understands how they can do the reprehensible things they do, can understand what brought them to this end, and even sympathize with them. They are the polar opposites of the flat, two dimensional cardboard cutouts that pass for characters in most other books.

amarteonJan 13, 2015

Gibbons' actions are extremely selfish in my opinion. I know someone who used to work behind the cash registers of gas stations in North Houston. He has been robbed and held at gun point multiple times. According to him, the experience is traumatic and made him fearful and stressed out at work. To put someone through that for no reason other than your own curiosity is intolerably inconsiderate.

Instead, Gibbons could have picked up a copy of Crime and Punishment or some other work of art if he wanted to acquire a sense of the desperation felt by "the disenfranchised of society." It is not a stretch to imagine that it probably sucks.

Great art can teach us about life without the burden of living through the worst it has to offer. Trying to force traumatic experiences on yourself at the expense of others is not art but stupidity.

bjhoops1onMay 21, 2013

I could not agree more.

One factor that I think contributes to the Asshole Ethos common among programmers is this idea that great men of genius cannot be held to the same moral standards as mere mortals. This idea, combined with an inflated sense of self-worth, makes for a host of Steve Jobs and Linus Torvalds wannabes, convinced that their special nature absolves them from social norms and responsibility.

The Raskolnikov-ian egoists ought to read Crime and Punishment...

I can fortunately say that in my experience, few programmers are assholes in person. Online forums are another matter. :)

trippypigonDec 10, 2018

Read one book. Dostoyevsky's ‘Crime and Punishment’, concentrating on all of the various ways he portrays righteousness.

He helps you see what's right in front of you, namely that people do wrong things not because they are evil or bad, but because they are weak.

Once you understand people as inherently weak, that they do stupid shit because they are essentially helpless, not because they're bad or evil or cruel, it becomes so much easier to forgive.

Mental toughness is all about forgiving and forgetting, and you learn to forgive only by accepting that people are weak, that people are essentially incapable of doing what's right.

Here one of my favorite quotes from the book:

“She is so unhappy! Ah, how unhappy! She believes there must be righteousness everywhere. She expects it. She doesn't see that it's impossible for people to be righteous and she is angry at it.”

mkfeuhreronJune 27, 2020

The whole concept is to have a defined plan, it is absolutely ok to not achieve KRs, what matters is you have motivation in working towards it. You have the ability to actually track it.

If you don't set a goal, you might just procastinate over it.

> Consider: the author has set himself to read 20 books per year. Suppose this is double of his standard. What he will do to fulfill his OKR? He's not going to choose a difficult read such as Ulysses, or an existential crisis inducing book such as Crime and Punishment, he will go for what is more superficial and easier to read, because his goal is not to be transformed by what he reads, his goal is to read 20 books.

- It is okay to read 10 books or X number of pages. Now, you actually started reading right! One's aim should not be to complete the KR for the sake of completion, but rather pushing yourself to do more, slowly improvements will be visible.

dangonOct 3, 2019

Dostoevsky did publish in serials! This is related to a story. Before he finished Crime and Punishment, which was being serialized, he had to write a whole other novel in order to prevent an unscrupulous publisher from capturing the rights to all his future work. In the end he was saved by dictating The Gambler to a young woman named Anna Snitkina who was the star pupil at the local shorthand academy (shorthand was an innovation at the time). During the day, he would work on finishing Crime and Punishment while she worked on transcribing The Gambler. Then in the evenings, he would dictate the next part of The Gambler and she would get it in shorthand. They would talk about the characters too.

They finished on the last possible day. The publisher cunningly closed his office that day and ordered all his staff not to receive the manuscript, but Dostoevsky went to the local police station, handed it in, and got a receipt. Thus his career was rescued. And then he and Anna got married.

It's fitting that this high-stakes drama produced The Gambler (a great short book btw), since Dostoevsky had gotten into it in the first place because of his gambling addiction. The marriage was a long and happy one and his life stabilized after that. His books maybe got a tad less exciting though.

Joseph Frank's biography is the best English source but he spends too many pages on this for a Google Books link to be useful. This one works though: https://books.google.com/books?id=1C1K-BnFGFIC&pg=PA51&dq=do...

Re serials: it's mind blowing that so many great masterpieces of the novel were written and published that way, and yet are so coherent, Dickens included. How on earth did they do it? But no doubt the non-masterpieces were less coherent.

3minus1onApr 9, 2014

You need to read Crime and Punishment

legoheadonApr 30, 2019

I read Crime and Punishment for the first time recently. found it quite boring and with limited meaning. but I am a 40 year old man and understood the concepts the book was introducing a long time ago.

I feel like with the advent of the internet, shocking concepts/ideas are hard to come by. I'm sure ideas in the book were provocative "back then," but nowadays, not so much.

I even watched some lectures on youtube discussing the book, which brought to light a thing or two, but still nothing of significance for me.

diminotenonFeb 25, 2013

I am very much a sub-vocalizer, and I have no idea how to pronounce a lot of fantasy words. What I find I do is I just don't sub-vocalize that word. I don't even think about it, I just don't have a way of pronouncing the word, so I "skip" it. Subsequently, I honestly couldn't tell you, were we to have a conversation about that story, what that word was. My comprehension of names I can't sub-vocalize is dismal compared to my comprehension of a) names I can and b) larger story concepts and whatnot that I can largely sub-vocalize.

When reading Crime and Punishment in school, I remember specifically saying, "I have no idea how to pronounce a whole bunch of stuff in here and I'm going to need to talk about it, so I'm going to specifically come up with a pronunciation." Without that conscious effort, I simply wouldn't have tried to vocalize the names whatsoever, despite that being my standard method of reading.

And to be clear, I can not sub-vocalize, but it's just... uncomfortable.

pandamanonMay 11, 2018

If you are interested in the context analysis in Crime and Punishment then you can read just those few pages. He goes over just the first couple sentences of the book if I recall correctly. It's not an explanation of the context for the entire book by any means but an example of how much context could be needed to read a simple sentence.

blowskionApr 2, 2013

To stretch this analogy beyond breaking point, of course you want some initial chemistry, but you need to ask what you're bringing to this relationship / reading.

Imagine you're friends hook you up on a blind date with someone described as "charismatic, supermodel looks, professorial brains". And you turn up, thinking "OK, Blind Date you have 30 minutes to impress me, or I'm outta here." That's what it's like picking up Tolstoy or Hugo and saying "if I'm not hooked after 30 pages, I'm just going to quit reading".

You need to bring something to the reading. Just as you expect Tolstoy to be interesting, so he expects you to be rather knowledgable about 19th Century European history, Christian philosophy, farming practices amongst serfs in Tsarist Russia. You can still fall in love with War and Peace without that knowledge (as I did), but it will take more effort from you and thus might take more than 30 pages.

And Tolstoy expects you to make, and to want to make, the effort to think about what he's writing. Dan Brown expects you to be time-pressed or naive - either unable or unwilling to challenge even his most basic assertions about history. So he writes for his audience, as Tolstoy writes for his. Tolstoy's motivations were closer to evangelism and pushing a political agenda. Dan Brown's are more about becoming rich.

And if all you are thinking while reading the book is "what am I getting from this?" then you're never going to enjoy it as you otherwise might. I read Crime and Punishment because I picked up quickly as I left the house for the airport. Stuck on a plane with nothing else to do, I slogged through the opening section, trying to cope with weird names and an alien culture. But that book, caused me to get into lots of other Russian literature, become Christian, and ultimately inspired some of the conversations that lead me to marrying my wife. I doubt anyone can say that about a Stig Larsson or James Patterson pageturner.

dangonSep 2, 2018

Dostoevsky's The Gambler was written to get him out of something like that. I couldn't find a good web page with the story, but https://books.google.com/books?id=heVDCgAAQBAJ&a... has the basics.

The story is better than that, though. He was working on one of his great novels as a serial (Crime and Punishment, I think), so he had to keep writing that during the day. But he had to produce another novel at the same time in order not to lose his future royalties to this publishing contract, which he had signed to pay off his own gambling debts. He was in despair, but a clever friend found the star pupil at the local shorthand academy and Dostoevsky dictated The Gambler to her in the evenings while she got it down in shorthand (a new technology at the time) and later transcribed it. They only had a few weeks, and finished it at the last minute, but the publisher had cunningly closed his office that day. He was no match for Anna, however, who took the manuscript to the nearest police station and got a receipt, rescuing Dostoevsky's career. Then he married her.

TeMPOraLonDec 5, 2011

I have a lot of non-IT stuff that I'd like to know at one time - so, in a spirit of sharing our TOKNOW lists, my current one:

    - Economics
- Micro
- Macro
- "Applied" - stock markets, credits, all that stuff - how it works, etc. (I know almost nothing about it)
- Knowledge about societies - how they form, how they function, etc.
- Bayesian probability (working on it right now, thanks to AI Class), set theory, maybe category theory
- Control theory (I do really, really regret I didn't care about this at university)
- Biology
- Genetics 101 & blood groups (I forgot all this stuff since high school)
- Nutrition 101
- First aid
- Pretty much whole physics (Feynman's lectures sitting on my bookshelf and waiting ;))
- History
- of civilization, especially Roman history
- of science, technology and enterpreneurship
- of modern geopolitical structures
- Geography
- World energy infrastructure
- How many resources do we have, where they are, how fast we use them
- How the world trade works
- Literature
- "Homeless People"
- "Crime and Punishment"
- ... and then some other good books

And that's really just (non-IT) knowledge; there are also some skills I'd like to acquire that are not listed. I know some (most?) of that stuff was covered in high school, however I somehow missed it all then (I didn't care / school wasn't really helpful to make me care). This list reflects some topics I spend time thinking about / worrying about, but at some point I realized I should either sit down and learn some of it, or stop caring that much about things I don't understand.

From the technical side (which is actually the main topic ;)), I keep all of this in plain text; it used to be .txt files somewhere on my hard drive, now it's in Org Mode.

shawndumasonDec 21, 2010

27. Crime and Punishment – Fyodor Dostoyevsky

NotPavlovsDogonJan 17, 2021

Russian surnames have gender. So a female surname would be Isaeva, but the male Isaev.

English writers that want to avoid what happens to a Russian family name when involving several members (it's complicated) take the smart way out and do it like this:
"after the Isaev family relocated" [1] https://theamericanreader.com/4-june-1855-fyodor-dostoevsky-...

But the reviewer at the guardian (or is it the writer of the book?) goes for "When the Isaevas moved" when writing about husband and wife. If you can't get the surnames right, how much trust should a charitable reader extend towards the review?

If you stumbled across "Hemingway she wife" in an essay on Papa's love life biography, instead of "Hemingway's wife" how much trust would that carry?

Source: I first read the D-dude at nine years of age, in the original, and then went back to him on multiple occasions. What a downer. Also, genius. I prefer Pushkin, the only optimist of Russian literature, but you gotta respect Dostoevsky: how much ahead of the time his realism was, and what an influence he left. And then lots of people simply enjoy his work. If you haven't read "Crime and punishment", strongly recommended.

As for his love life, I read many opposing viewpoints, but I prefer to limit my judgement to the work, not the person. Too messy. Unreliable sources.

richiebful1onOct 22, 2020

P&V end up with a very readable and accessible translation for English speakers. For someone like myself who can read Russian newspapers, but struggles to finish older literature, it's not ideal, because I can look at the original text and see the lost poetry.

If you're interested in Pevear and Volokhonsky's translation methodology, check this out: http://columbiajournal.org/translation-lecture-richard-pevea...

> Pevear explained that they first began translating when they happened to both be reading Crime and Punishment at the same time – Pevear in English, Volokhonsky in Russian – and they compared sentences and saw how radically different they were. Since then, they have developed a system: Volokhonsky makes the first draft, trying to translate as literally as possible [...], explaining any clichés or colloquialisms. Then Pevear looks at the “scribble” (as Volokhonsky calls it), and he “puts it into English” (Pevear said, sighing). Pevear asks Volokhonsky questions, and, in the creating of the third draft, she answers them. Finally, before sending anything off to their editor, Pevear reads the English version out loud while Volokhonsky follows along in the original Russian text.

andyjennonJune 27, 2008

"Crime and Punishment" (Fyodor Dostoyevsky) changed my life.

jkushonDec 4, 2007

Crime and Punishment (Dostoevsky)

House Of Leaves (Mark Danielewski)

shantlyonDec 16, 2019

Hopefully I'll knock at least a couple off my "most shameful not to have read" list:

- Paradise Lost

- The Divine Comedy

- The Aeneid

- Moby Dick

- Middlemarch

- Othello & at least the lesser Henriad

- Any of several Russian novels, of which I've read none (War and Peace, Brothers Karamazov, Crime and Punishment probably being the biggest)

- Kafka's The Trial

- The Canterbury Tales (I've read Sir Gawain & The Green Knight but not this, WTF is wrong with me?)

- Don Quixote

scandoxonMay 11, 2018

Well if you've read Frankl then I think you should read Primo Levi. The Drowned and The Saved and also If This Is A Man. One could say he came to less easily swallowed conclusions, but I think it is essential reading.

For me personally however I think Dostoyevsky's Crime and Punishment more or less informed my world-view from a very young age and continues to do so.

emodendroketonMay 21, 2018

I'm actually reading Crime and Punishment now, and the edition I'm reading has pretty frequent footnotes explaining all the Russian cultural references. But really, it goes beyond being Russian, doesn't it? You'd miss stuff if you weren't very familiar with the Bible, or by virtue of the fact that the Imperial Russian system it's set in no longer exists, or if you hadn't read Hugo or Pushkin, or a million other things. I'm not sure anybody catches everything casually reading the book, or even through years of study.

Hemingway himself considered himself pretty influenced by Russian authors. It's often speculated that his terse writing was in part influenced by Constance Garnett's translations of them.

mcsonkaonJune 27, 2020

> Consider: the author has set himself to read 20 books per year. Suppose this is double of his standard. What he will do to fulfill his OKR? He's not going to choose a difficult read such as Ulysses, or an existential crisis inducing book such as Crime and Punishment, he will go for what is more superficial and easier to read, because his goal is not to be transformed by what he reads, his goal is to read 20 books.

The problem with this I see is the KR itself, not Objective. In 2019 I choose similar Objective which pushed me towards finishing books I didn't enjoy or valuable, so I decided to set the KR as number of pages read or just 30 minutes a day.

nine_konJan 12, 2020

I think the idea is like that: if you think that the murderer in a A. Christie's story is shown unrealistically, you can write it off as a literary device to create an entertaining puzzle, and not expect a serious treatise on the criminal's psychology, motives, etc.

If you need a deep(er) view of a murderer's soul, you open Crime and Punishment, also a literary work and not a piece of academic research, and find it there.

For SF in 1970s, there was no such higher tier; there was no literary futurology. Lem himself was one of the biggest figures in the field of literary futurology, framed as SF. "Hard SF", like the works of Peter Watts or Greg Egan, did not yet exist.

m0zgonApr 30, 2019

That's probably because you've read it in English. For the life of me I don't get why non-Russian people read Russian classical literature. Just don't. It is true that there aren't really any Western authors of the same stature as Dostoevsky or Tolstoy, but really, you aren't really reading what they wrote. Their work requires quite a bit of thought, and that thought requires quite a bit built-in stuff that a native wouldn't even notice.

30% of the meaning is not there because you don't have the same cultural background. Another 15-20% is lost in translation. What remains is still formidable, but nowhere near as good as the original work. I happen to also have recently re-read Crime and Punishment, but in my native Russian, after a gap of some 25 years. I've found it very vivid, engaging, and full of nuance I just wasn't even able see when I was a teenager. Likewise I have fairly recently re-read War and Peace, and it is now my favorite book of all time. When I was much younger it seemed "too long" and extremely boring, because it requires quite a bit of lived experience to fully appreciate, and not just any experience, but experience that only someone who has lived in Russia for an extended period of time (not necessarily originally Russian) would have. Really fundamental, basic things, which Americans just can't even begin to understand. I.e. how the government is perceived there (hint: Tsar-like figure is still perceived as a desirable thing), what it means to have a land war on your soil (Russia had many, some extremely devastating), Russian ideas about patriotism, yet at the same not liking how they do things over there, Russian fatalism, how women are perceived by men and the other way around, etc, etc.

Having spent 20+ years in the US and having traveled quite a bit, I've recently read The Grapes of Wrath. I liked the book, and the use of language in it (it almost reads like poetry at times), but I very strongly suspect I didn't quite "get" it to the extent that an American would, for the same reasons I alluded to above. And I have vastly more "American" lived experience than most Americans have "Russian".

serheionFeb 6, 2009

In Crime and Punishment by Dostoyevsky the main character complains at one point that the low ceiling in his apartment is constricting his thoughts. So Dostoyevsky had this notion right quite a while ago.

(Then again, the main character had also recently murdered an old lady, so the main problem is not in the apartment.)

dmitriidonApr 22, 2021

They are required reading at school. So many people are turned away from them just because all soul is sucked from them by school curriculum demanding you dissect their works and write non-sensical, highly formulaic essays like "Author's position and means of expressing of said position in the novel 'Crime and Punishment'" [1]

[1] Examples of essay topics: http://velikayakultura.ru/temy-shkolnyh-sochineniy/temyi-f-m...

romwellonOct 17, 2018

Same here - and on both sides of the Atlantic.

That's also how I got to read Crime and Punishment twice: in Russian, when I was in school in Ukraine, and then in English, at a high school in Brooklyn the very next year. Had a blast both times, really.

Our AP English teacher that quarter was a six-foot-something metalhead whose name I, unfortunately, forgot. But his class is one of my warmest memories of those years. One time he took the whole class to a Russian restaurant (as an optional excursion, we paid for ourselves) just to give the kids a better immersion into the Russian culture (the school was right next to a Russian-speaking neighborhood anyway). Even for me, it was something that created a real-life context for the fictional work, and of course made it more exciting.

So I'd say - assigned reading is not necessarily the death knell for a work of art. It really does depend on the teacher. However, statistically, it probably kills it for most people, so in the very least, there's no point in having a nationwide standard.

Which brings me back to OP's point: the problem isn't just that there's assigned reading in ex-USSR countries, it's that everyone has the same assigned reading. That has a devastating effect, I think. At least in the US, even if a book is destroyed in the classroom, there are decent chances that most of the students won't be affected because they'll have different assigned reading.

jsomersonApr 5, 2008

This was the only part of the essay that irked me. Bad writing in general has a low information density; the problem is not exclusive to fiction.

It doesn't help that information is embedded structurally in a novel, which makes it harder to tease out. But good fiction (say, Ulysses or Crime and Punishment or Nine Stories) is as rich as any essay or monograph.

It's also not clear that density, in the strict sense, is what I'm after when I read. If so I'd be buried in technical papers, when what I really want is something to tickle my brain; to that end, I wouldn't want to lose any one of arXiv, the Engineering library, or the literature section at Borders.

mindcrimeonDec 3, 2012

Sure, I don't dispute any of that. And, in fact, I mentioned Anna Karenina partly because I bought a copy a few months ago because it is on my list of books to read. But I do question whether or not it has any particular value which exceeds any of the innumerable other works I could read with that time instead.

Of course that might lead you ask "then why are you planning to read it"? To which I can only say "because it sounds interesting and exactly because I haven't read much Russian literature and I want to broaden my horizons a bit". But I'm not reading it because I want to be able to impress some hipster pseudo-intellectuals, or because it's something you're "supposed" to read. I just want to see what it's all about. Same with Crime and Punishment, which I started recently (but got distracted from and set aside temporarily).

Mostly I would read Tolstoy for the same reason I would read Nietzsche - to break through our regrettable tendency to take the past and its people for granted.

I agree with that, but I find that fiction from (and set in) Victorian era England has been my primary outlet for thinking about and appreciating the past in that regard. That's certainly not to discredit the Russian stuff you speak of, just saying that reading Tolstoy or Dostoevsky or whatever, isn't the only way to tap into that historical perspective.

It's one thing to read about the ideas Nietzsche developed on a Wikipedia article, it's wholly another to read him in his own words and suddenly find yourself thrust into contact with a whole mind, a living, breathing bundle of thoughts and anxieties and dream, a human being palpably aching to find meaning, caught in the middle of one of the greatest social upheavals of human history.

Indeed. I greatly enjoyed reading Nietzsche's Thus Spake Zarathustra and have quite a few of his other works on my list.

tropdroponOct 22, 2020

On the contrary – I have read Crime and Punishment in both Russian and English. Where other translators eschew nuances for readability and "story," Pevear and Volokhonsky really try to somehow carry that nuance over across the cultural divide and preserve as much hidden meaning from the original as they can. Other English translations felt like books converted to be child's literature.

Perhaps your problem is less these translators, and more sufficiently complicated literature that needs some time to digest...

westoncbonOct 10, 2017

I wonder how the 'psychological novel' which was supposed to be invented in James' The Portrait of a Lady (1880) (according to the article) is distinct from, e.g., Crime and Punishment (1866) (or Notes from Underground, though I guess that was a novella so it doesn't count). Is Portrait of a Lady more psychologically focused, or is the way it treats the psychological content somehow different?

siberianbearonOct 17, 2018

When I was living in the United States and studying Russian, I started to read some Russian literature. After reading some short stories by Chekhov, I decided to delve into something harder: Dostoevsky.

I couldn't understand the first page of Crime and Punishment even with a dictionary. Dostoevsky has a very eloquent way of writing with very long sentences and complicated grammar, but it's very hard for a non-native speaker to understand.

So, I went to a Russian colleague of mine, who recommended that I try to read "The Master and the Margarita" instead of Crime and Punishment. I found that I could read and mostly understand it, but the plot made no sense.

I told this experience to my Russian teacher, and she laughed uncontrollably. She said that it's true that the grammar in The Master in the Margarita is easier, but you'll never really understand the plot without having lived in the Soviet Union. She said that every element in the story is a jab at some aspect of life or politics from that era.

I continued to stick with short stories by Chekhov and Gogol after that.

madaxe_againonMay 21, 2021

It resonated deeply with me - there is something about Russian literature that worms its way deep into your essence, in a way I’ve never quite found with western literature, which, while impactful, somehow doesn’t have the same long-lasting depth of effect. I haven’t read Crime and Punishment in nearly 20 years, but I can still see Raskolnikov’s grotty abode, still feel the panic at the confrontation with Lizaveta, still feel the dazed ramblings through the streets of St Petersburg, the need for absolution. I still feel the blank and bleak repetitiveness of the existence of Ivan Denisovich, building up and breaking down, just because.

te_plattonMar 24, 2018

A few years ago I re-read Crime and Punishment, 30 years after trying to get through it in high school. I was blown away by how deeply it affected me this time around. It's not so much a crime story as much as a "why is there crime?" story - or even a "what forces in my mind and in everyone else's minds are really shaping my moral actions?" story. (I just searched the internet for that last quote and apparently I need to read more Kant). I had some Russian friends where I was working at the time and asked them about Crime and Punishment and they all just frowned and nodded for a minute before one of them said "yes... very dark..."

For any of you here who may have read it too young I highly recommend going back and reading it again

FabHKonApr 27, 2019

Indeed. Fyodor Dostoevsky's Crime and Punishment comes in at 2MB, obviously that can't contain anything insightful.

And then I find myself looking at the website of a restaurant or event space, and need just a phone number or opening hours or so - maybe 10 bytes of actual information - and am buried in mountains of useless blather and "design" and ads and trackers and assorted other random rubbish.

siberianbearonMar 14, 2017

I read a bunch of them (in English) when I was a university student: that's where my first exposure came from.

When I started to study Russian, I read one or two of his stories in this book [1], which was great because it has English and Russian versions on opposite pages. I got to enjoy reading in Russian because I didn't constantly have to look up every tenth word in a dictionary.

Russian is a hard language but there are some still harder. To understand magazine articles and carry on simple conversations on arbitrary topics is a time investment of about 600 hours. To read Chekhov and speak really well on advanced topics is about double that, or 1200 hours. Chekhov's style is close to modern Russian and his style of writing is more straightforward than earlier writers. To read Dostoyevsky... well, hell if I know, I can barely make it through the first page of Crime and Punishment even with a dictionary even after all this time investment and living in Russia for a few years! It's like a different language.

[1] https://www.amazon.com/Russian-Stories-Dual-Language-Book-En...

mindcrimeonJuly 21, 2013

I try to mix it up now and then. I usually go for at least one "classic" a year, although I don't think I finished one last year. I started Crime and Punishment but set it aside and never finished it. Somewhere around here there is also a copy of Madame Bovary that's half read, that I need to revisit at some point.

That said, last year, my big thing - outside of "utility" books, were books on running and bike racing. I read things like Running Through The Wall, Born To Run, Slaying The Badger, Running on Empty, Racing Through The Dark, Eat & Run, The Belgian Hammer, Run!, It's Not Just About The Bike and The Secret Race. Fascinating stuff, for anyone who is interested in either running or bicycle racing.

agentultraonDec 16, 2019

Going to finish Crime and Punishment, Year of the Monkey (Patti Smith), The Children of Húrin (along with many cross references and letters) (Tolkien), re-reading A Game of Thrones for fun... as for 2020 I might read Slaughterhouse 5 again and work through George Sand.

Technical things I am working through are the:

- https://www.extension.harvard.edu/open-learning-initiative/a... along with the Artin text, writing proofs out by hand and in Lean.

- Seven Sketches in Compositionality: https://arxiv.org/abs/1803.05316

cafardonFeb 3, 2020

If a paperback is sufficiently old, it might just break apart on you. I can think of at least two that have come apart in my hands during the last few years.

I recycled them. A book once severed is going to keep shedding pages. It's fine to read once, but probably will not stand up to a second or subsequent reading. On the whole, I'd just as soon not buy books that I'm not going to look into again after the first reading.

Having said that, Crime and Punishment is not really a scarce resource, nor I suppose Infinite Jest or Middlesex. I'd bet that I could buy all three at a used bookstore for less than $30. The author may be stepping up the recycling date for the books, but by how much?

forkLdingonOct 14, 2018

I've read some Chinese novels translated into English (I'm a Chinese speaker) but more Russian ones like Crime and Punishment and War and Peace.

My two cents is that there are some subtleties that are cultural but for the most part its understandable from the reader's perspective as to what the author was getting to. Although google and wikipedia is your friend when it comes to cultural references.

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